Kyley gets a visit from her goddess-self and she’s MAD. We unpack the ways we fear our own power, why we hide from ourselves, and what might happen if we let ourselves get really big.
Kyley gets a visit from her goddess-self and she’s MAD.
We unpack the ways we fear our own power, why we hide from ourselves, and what might happen if we let ourselves get really big.
Retreat information - https://www.theworkwithtom.com/9-16-march-brazil.html
Eva's instagram: @iamevaliao
Book a discovery call with Eva
Kyley's Instagram: @kyleycaldwell
Kyley's free mini-course
[00:00:00]
Kyley: Hey, it's Eva. Hey, it's Kyley.
Eva: Welcome back to hello universe.
Kyley: You really do the best sound effects. I show you.
Eva: Hello, my dear friend. Once again, thank you for waking up at the ass crack of dawn to meet me while I'm here in
Kyley: Asia. I think I'll miss this.
I think when you I think when you're in Brazil, I'll be like, there's no reason to wake up. But I don't get to the, the, the act of starting my day by talking with you, like just sets me up for the [00:01:00] best fucking day
Eva: though. Well, thank you. Well, uh, yeah, we'll see that. I think we'll, I think I'll, we'll like that.
Once I get to Brazil folks, Kyley and I will be closer in time zones than ever before. So ever,
Kyley: ever the combination of me having childcare during the day and us being in the same time zone four years in, we finally
Eva: figured it out. It'd be a whole new world. All right. So before we jump into this week's topic of power, which I'm like, so excited to dive into, what do you want to share with our beautiful listeners, Kyley?
Kyley: Um, I'm just going to drop that alchemy is coming, which I think I have been dropping on the podcast for like months. I've been just warning you all like dun dun dun dun, but for real alchemy is coming. Um, so you should sign up for the wait list because it's, if you don't know, it's. The most powerful program that I teach, it's all about money, [00:02:00] but it's actually all about trauma and it's actually all about joy and compassion and like living in your body and in your heart and feeling safe in the world.
Um, and it's really fucking big magic and I cannot wait. And so I'm going to be opening doors soon. And if you want all the details and all that good extra early bird shit, get on the wait list, which is at the link in the
Eva: comments. Yay. I can't wait for this to start. I know that money has been a huge portal for you and therefore you've been able to walk people through who also have like money stuff to come out of this, like realizing that it's also so not about money and you've guided me through a bunch of my own money stuff.
And so, yeah, Kyley is my go to person to talk about all those weird knots and triggers that money can, yeah, I think bring up for almost everybody and in different ways. And I think anyone who signs up is going to be [00:03:00] really lucky. So get on that wait list, friends.
Kyley: How about you, my love?
Eva: Well, I am leaving for Brazil in a week, uh, in like from today when we're recording this.
And then, um, Tom Compton, my wonderful friend and, uh, my, one of my favorite teachers is hosting a retreat in Brazil where I will be and I'm helping him plan it and I'm so excited about it. I'm like. Reeking out. Cause I just think it's going to be so much fun. And it feels like such an honor and a privilege to be able to.
Part of this thing that I believe in so much so, um, at the time of airing, you'll have about like two weeks left to sign up, which I know sounds bananas. If you've been thinking about it, which I know some of you have been because you've reached out to me. You still have time. And honestly, I feel like people are going to be signing up to like the very last minute.
And we just had another person sign up today. And, um, yeah. If you're, you may be familiar. If you're not familiar, I'm, um, a really big fan of [00:04:00] Byron Katie's The Work. It has been probably one of the most like the, you know, I have a lot of different spiritual practices and this one takes the cake, I guess.
And so, um, this is what the retreat will be about. Tom will be facilitating the work. And every time I've done one of these retreats, my whole world has just been blown wide open and every anything that I like any problem or area of confusion where I'm stuck has just, I walk away being like, Oh, that's no longer a problem and it's bananas.
So not to mention it's going to be taking place like where I. will be newly living. So like, I'm excited to invite people into this space. It's going to be in the jungle, this beautiful, magical, unrealistic, enchanted mountain with the, there's going to be like a beautiful hotel. It's a surf lesson. Oh, there's also an optional ayahuasca retreat at the very end, which is something I'm very nervous about, but also excited about.
So anyway, [00:05:00] if you need something new, if you need something that works, if you were just like feeling a call to like really deepen your spiritual self, like that's how I got started in this. This in this work too. I was like, I don't really know what this is, but I just feel so called to it. And it's been since changed my life.
Um, you can
Kyley: message me always the things to listen to that feeling. I'm like, I don't even know, but I'm in, Oh my God. That's the best shit
Eva: every single time. And like the way that I was led to this was truly. bananas. I, you know, the whole story about it, but I just was like, I don't know why I'm signing up for this.
Like, I don't know. I don't know. I ended up in Costa Rica and I was like, Oh, I'm so fucking glad I listened anyway. Yeah. So I'm helping plan. So if you have questions, you can email me, you can send me a message on, um, Instagram. Oh. And I just want to add that. Yes. Like it is far away and it's in Brazil, but it's for such a ridiculously affordable rate for like.
What I've seen and what's available out there. Um, it's kind of blowing my mind. I'm like, Tom, I think you could [00:06:00] charge like two, three times more, but he's doesn't really care so much. So anyway, that's, I think just something of note.
Kyley: Yeah. Um, I, everybody should run. If this show wasn't hosted over Birdie's birthday, I would have been, I would have spent a long time thinking about whether trying to figure out if I could be there, uh, because it's, I know it's going to be really incredible and
Eva: powerful and beautiful.
Well, I'm actually really excited. I mean, I'm so, you know, I trust that there'll be a day when it, when you do come and that's like, if, when that happens, like I hope. Everyone from the, like, I feel that's the one who, that, like, podcast listeners all join in on. Oh my God.
Kyley: Yes. I know there's a couple of listeners who are like, try, have been trying to figure out if they can come to this one.
And yes, I would actually love if one of these retreats is actually sneakily the hello universe.
Eva: I think that'd be amazing. Okay. All right. So what would you like to discuss
Kyley: today, Kyley? Yeah. Okay. So I am bringing a topic that feels alive and [00:07:00] also messy. And by messy, I just mean like I'm still sifting through something.
Um, naturally I was like, Eva help. Let's talk about this on the podcast. And this is a topic that in some ways I think is often alive for me. And it's this idea of like being powerful and. And what it really means to give ourselves permission to be really powerful and how, like how to move through where some of the resistance lives.
Um, and in some ways, like I said, this is alive for me because in some ways this is like the thing I do with people, right? Like I sent out a survey to some of my beloved, um, closest clients and sort of was like, what, in your words, what do I do? And a lot of them spoke to like, Being bold and being powerful, right?
Permission to be those things. Um, but we're also just always going deeper into all, you know, our own medicine. [00:08:00] So yeah, lately there's just been this like energy swirling about being powerful, you know, I've been hinting on the podcast that I've been going through a pretty big initiation and a lot has been shifting and changing internally.
And a lot of that is pointing me towards surrender and joy, but also taking up space, being powerful, having the impact that you're hungry to have, um, in all sorts of ways. And. And I can feel that there's, there's ways in which I'm also like afraid of, I know that there's ways that I'm afraid of that. Um, so that's the, like, that's the headline.
Um, and then in particular, I'll share with listeners and with Eva, the story of this vision that I had, this is what probably like, no, I got, I haven't even told Eva this story offline guys. And we talk all the time, but I was like, no, I'm saving this for real time on the podcast. One morning at like three o'clock in the morning, I just wake up Bing. [00:09:00] Uh, this doesn't happen to me very often. And when it does, I often feel like I've been like jostled awake, like they're like, Hey, it's finally quiet. We can talk. And so one of the things that I've started doing instead of letting my mind ruminate is I just kind of like turn.
You know, I, I turned to, you know, the casting characters of gods and ancestors that I'm often chatting with. I'm like, okay, who wants to talk? Who woke me up? And what do you have to say? And immediately I got pointed in towards like my, towards me, towards my own God self, towards my deeper self. Right. It was like, this isn't about anybody else.
This is about you and you. And I got this image that was so visceral and powerful. Um, If listeners go back way, way back to, I think one of our, like our second episode with Zaylee Kane, I talked about how, um, I, whenever I imagine like the part of myself that I'm most scared of, she shows up as [00:10:00] Bertha Mason.
Do you remember this? Oh yeah. Yeah. So for you who don't know, Bertha Mason is a character in, um, Jane Eyre and she's The love interest in Jane Eyre has a secret crazy wife that he's locked in the attic. It's a strange book. It's a classic. Everyone should read it. And Bertha Mason has been like locked in the attic.
She's a crazy person, maybe because she's been locked in a fucking attic. There's a great. Another book that actually tells her story called White Sargasso Sea. I highly recommend it. Anyway, eventually she, she's constantly trying to burn the house down. Eventually she burns the house down. And for years, whenever I like tapped into the part of myself that I was like kind of most afraid of, it was this, it was Bertha Mason.
She had this like long scraggly hair. She's like this crazy nightgown and she's trying to set everything on fire. And I haven't seen her in a long time. Like I've been doing this like shadow work integration shit. I have not seen Bertha Mason for a long time. I kind of forgot about her. It's three o'clock in the morning and I get pulled into, like, I know [00:11:00] that's, I know that this is like, it's like, okay, you have to go talk to your God self and she shows up as Bertha Mason and she's in a cage.
She's in a prison, like a County jail kind of style prison. And she has this giant, this is big metal cup. Like you'd like have your like prison, your water and you know, she's rattling it back and forth on the bars of the cage was just this, like. Like fuck everything. Like I'm untouchable, even as I'm stuck in this jail kind of vibe.
And she's like, got the matted hair. She's got the crazy nightgown and she just looks at me in this vision and she's rattling the jump, the bars with her cop. And it's like, you have got to let me, Oh my God,
Eva: Kyley. Whoa.
Kyley: I'm going to get like tears in my eyes. Like retelling the story. It felt so powerful.
She is like, you have got like, this is you. I am you. [00:12:00] I am the most powerful, generous compact. I am. I am all the best fucking parts of you. And you have got to let me. Out. And she's just like rattling the bars. Yeah. And then eventually in this vision, she just turns around and walks out the back and is like, just kidding.
Nothing can actually hold me. And then she transforms into this like really beautiful woman, but with the vibes of like, like, I don't, I'm not doing this for anybody else. Right. So she, and so. Still this very, like, I don't know, confident, like none of this matters. And she's like, puts her legs up and she's smoking a cigarette.
Yes. And she's like, just kidding. Nothing can actually hold me back. Like all of this is just an illusion. And also you will stop feeling afraid if you stop being afraid of me. And you, like, you gotta let me out. It's time. Like, that's it. We reached the [00:13:00] point. We reached the end of this. You're afraid of me.
It's time. Uh, and it felt so big. And also I was like, cool. I don't know how. I
Eva: mean, let's just take a moment to like pause. to applaud the amazingness of the story. I, I think I'm very moved by it. Um, and I have follow up questions if I may. Yeah. My question is, my interpretation of this is that. You know, Bertha Mason was actually more of a question.
But what, what about Bertha Mason is scary to you? Right. Because like, is it the part that like, she's insane and she looks like, you know, the rags and all of that, but also, and those are the parts that we end up like projecting within ourselves. Right. But also. This to me is like the ultimate form of the shadow work that you do, which is like, Hey, let's [00:14:00] integrate all parts of us, especially the parts that we are most scared of, that we hide away or that we reject.
Kyley: Right, right. Well, and I think what I have often been, a lot of my integration work for a long time has been, um, these wounded parts of myself, right? These parts of myself who are who, who are, who have been hurt, who are, um. You know, I've been traumatized with various parts of myself that have been kind of looping in the pain of, of, yeah, of suffering.
And this feels different because, and the, and so part of that, part of the, part of the reason why we reject these parts of ourselves, looping and trauma is because we're afraid to re experience the trauma, right? We're, we're afraid to actually feel the shame or the grief or the pain that's attached to them.
But this is different. It has felt different because it's like, you're not afraid of me because I've been hurt. You're afraid of me because I'm big, [00:15:00] right? So, so it's like, it's, it's this invitation to, you know, and I think our conversation about anger the other week is also kind of related to this in ways that I could speak to, but also are still coming clear.
I think a big part of what feels different to me about this is like. We're not running around right now scooping up the like, you know, parts of ourselves who have been hurt and forgotten. We've done that. We've been doing that. But this is about the part of you who's actually bigger than all of this bullshit and might fuck some shit up.
I mean, I think that's, I think, I think the birth of Mason imagery, I, I, I suspect has to do with how much she does not give a shit and is destructive, right? She burns the house down, right? She's just not interested in conforming. That's, I think that's, that's her, and some of your questions is also why I wanted to bring this because I, I'm [00:16:00] still letting this kind of unfurl inside of me, but, but I think what feels really different is that this is the monster of you.
Of actually the me who isn't wounded. Mm-Hmm. isn't right. Who isn't like hemmed in by her trauma and her bullshit and her limiting beliefs. Like, this is the me who's like jk, no bars can contain me. Like I'm just gonna walk out the back and transform into a beautiful woman or like, you know, and Oh, am I locked in a county jail?
And I, and I, and I just like piss everybody off by banging my cup around. Like, I don't actually, like, I do not care. Mm-Hmm. , um. I do not. So it's not
Eva: because she's like crazy or tattered. It's because the energy and the attitude of, I don't give a fuck. And I'm a total bad ass is
Kyley: that it's that. And, and, and I think that in my, my psyche interpreting that as If you actually embody the like level of I don't give a fuck [00:17:00] that I would like to have access to and that clearly like this big part of my inner being is pulling me towards that my psyche is really afraid that that is destructive, right?
That that is isolation, madness, burn the house down, like it will just cause it will it will just wreak havoc and destruction and just. Roy, everything that I touch, uh,
Eva: so many fuels about this guy. Like, I mean, this is like the origin story of like, so I think many women in general, it's like, and I'm always brought back to the, the, we've had many conversations about this before, but I think the first time.
It really became clear to me was on the podcast where it was like, Oh, you know, we're all just afraid of being burned at the stake. Like we have all this, we don't going back to like ancestral times. It's like, well, probably because if you were a woman or this is what I relate to and you had powers and wisdom and that was so, that was incredibly dangerous.
It was a huge, huge threat. And so we're all, [00:18:00] so I think there's, it's really common to do this dance of like bigness. And, and also like, but that, but like being punished for that. That's what I think of.
Kyley: I love your point about the witch hunt. And I think the energy as I'm experiencing this is, is slightly different, which doesn't mean I won't get to the witch hunt here because I feel like that energy of the witch hunt is, is this external judgment and this attack that comes because the outside world deems you undesirable, but the actual flavor of this desire.
It feels more like related to like the Medusa in the sense that she just turns everything to stone. Right. She looks and she destroys it. Um, and, uh, and it's like the essence of her being is destructive and, and in particular this fear that I have, [00:19:00] um, and this resistance to this part of myself is, That if she gets out of jail, right, if I actually let this part of me, who I, I feel like is, she's the part of me who, you know, doesn't give a fuck, as I keep saying, who has this kind of magnetic confidence that comes from it.
It doesn't matter. It can't touch me. Right. Um, that if I fully let her and also there's like a kind of really intense joy that I, that I think she has access to because again, she doesn't give a fuck. Right. She could be completely ostracized and she would cackle the whole way. Right. But I think my fear of her is.
That she'll destroy everything that I love.
Eva: Okay. So, so this is something that you've mentioned before this, this fear, essentially that like [00:20:00] at some core level, or there's some like intrinsic part of you that is destructive. And I think I'm really curious
Kyley: about. That. Yeah. I mean, I've talked about this before.
Yeah. It's not the, it's the first time I feel like I've had such a strong calling from this part of myself. It's like, time is up. Like we're all done being. You know, we're done with this separation of self, right? And so that feels like, and I do, I think part of it is that I also do think this part of myself is destructive in a couple of different ways.
One is I think she will burn the house down if it sets her free. Right? I think she is very comfortable destroying things. That aren't actually helping her right that she might really, really, that I might really, really love, right? Things that I might really, really love if they [00:21:00] are actually secretly a prison.
This part of me knows if there's some way in which I am actually some cost of being with that thing that I love is some, some self sacrifice that I've continued to give this part of me. It's like, Nope, we're out. It doesn't matter how much you love it. If, if sacrifice is required, we're out, you know,
Eva: this part of you is like, we'll risk everything for freedom.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. For truth. For freedom. Like, that's the vibe that I get. And that's something that I can also completely relate to. And for our own
Kyley: joy. Yeah. We'll risk everything for freedom and, and for, yeah, and for joy.
Eva: Okay. This is very interesting to me. Um, you know, I think. We've talked about this before.
We each have our own flavor of different, like, fears and hangups and whatever. And I, you know, my, you don't, cause you don't have the fear of going crazy, right? That's not.
Kyley: Nope. Every once in a blue moon it shows up, but I'm like, Oh, this is what even I get it. So I've had like, I've, I've had enough of [00:22:00] interaction with it that I can relate to it, but it's not.
And who knows, maybe three years from now, we'll be a podcast episode. It'll be like, Whoa, my actual biggest fear under all the things is that I'm going to go crazy. I wouldn't be
Eva: surprised. Totally. Right. Yeah. I can see. Yeah, exactly. Like. And I can see how like this destructive piece, I'm asking because I'm like, it's interesting to me because I don't think it's like a current huge life story for me now, but also I'm like.
Oh, in two months, I could be like, Oh, I, I see what you're saying. Yes. Like, I get it. But, but, um, I think what's actually really interesting to me is that, and I don't know if this is, you know, we're piecing this out together. Is then the implication, some sort of unconscious implication that in order for you to be free and joyful, you actually have to destroy everything.
And I, and I asked that question because I actually don't think that that's. Uncommon. Meaning I've seen it so often where people are like, there's like a sense of like restrainment somewhere. Like basically [00:23:00] if we are not 100 percent free and few of us are actually, you know, like I think a small percentage of humankind, but we're not actually a hundred percent free yet.
There's always going to be some part of us that's gonna be like,
Kyley: fuck
Eva: this. And then we think that the answer is like total chaos, destruction, blowing shit up because that's the only way. And I wonder if sometimes that's like a feeling That's a result of feeling caged in. But at the same time, even as I speak this out loud, I'm like, I don't know if that's.
Kyley: Oh, that's kind of like the pendulum swing. I mean, it's interesting because I think, you know, so much of the journey that I've been talking about on the podcast lately is how anger has been showing up. And, and I think I shared before on the show that I kept hearing this line, like your anger will set us free.
Your anger will set us free, which is surprising language. Um, but I think.
You know, and I think, I think anger is also a part of ourselves that's willing to destroy things for the [00:24:00] sake of our freedom. And as I've shared on the show, I'm much more comfortable with like grief, for example, than I am with anger, right? I'm, I, I, I'm uncomfortable with it because of, because it's destructive abilities.
And it's interesting, actually, the other day, someone reached out to me, a friend of mine, a former client of mine was like, Hey, can I ask you a question? Like, can I ask you a question? Like I'm kind of, I'm in this like money situation. And would you mind if I asked you, which I appreciated the question beforehand, you know, and I was like, yeah, absolutely.
I would be happy. So they dropped their question. And I sent them like a couple of voice notes back about what was what my read on the energy of the situation and like what I would. What I think their, what I think their birth of Mason, what I think their bigger self is actually asking them to do to move through it.
And I saw all of the places where I wanted to put caveats and all the places where I wanted to use couching [00:25:00] language for like, you know. Pointing out a pattern that this person has been living and then I immediately wanted to add language that was like, and we all live this pattern and it's, you know, I know this pattern.
I immediately wanted to kind of like basically soften the blow. Right. So as you have pointed out, I'm a seer, especially, you know, especially people that I've known for a while or worked with it. Like I can see the pattern. Right. But I had a lot of fear, and I, and I have for a long time, that my seeing will cause harm, that it will hurt someone's feelings if I say, this is what you're doing, this is exactly the pattern that's happening, and, and my fear is that that will cause harm, and so I couch the language.
So I'm saying something very, like, you know. There's a reason people come, like, if you come to me, it's because you want what I have to say, and yet I'm, like, taking the, like, bite out of it, or the sting, like, maybe it does sting a little bit, but maybe that's part of the helpfulness. You were trying
Eva: to make it, like, a little bit more digestible, like, easier on the, easier on the.
Kyley: Paladin, which is [00:26:00] actually, I think, really like coddling behavior, right? Cause it's like, oh, you're doing this thing that's causing you a lot of harm, but like, it's okay. Everybody does it. And like, it might be true, but also I am pulling, I'm actually robbing people of the opportunity to be uncomfortable and let that discomfort like move them forward.
Right. Um, and I just watched. Where the language that I wanted to use was showing up and I think mostly I just watched and didn't add it. I think a couple of times I did add it in. Um, and obviously the person was like, thank you. This was exactly what I, right. Like, you're 100 percent right. Thank you so much.
And also if anyone else listened to it, they'd be like, this is very
Eva: compassionate. Right? Exactly. Totally. Isn't that? Oh, yes, I totally get that. But,
Kyley: but because what I think I'm really afraid of is that, like, the truth that I have to speak is. Destructive and the truth that I have to speak will like pause harm in some way.
And so I'm just like afraid. And so [00:27:00] I see.
Eva: Okay. Okay. Yeah, so that's okay. So then what I'm hearing you say is that 'cause, 'cause we're talking about two different things here. We're talking about bigness and power, like that's one thing. And then, and destructiveness is like the other
Kyley: theme. How are they two different things?
Well, I think. I think
Eva: what it sounds like what you're saying is that you're afraid that your power, your bigness is inherently destructive, like,
Kyley: I also think it is
Eva: one. Also, because I don't think just what I think depends on what you mean by destructive, because I don't actually think destructive is a bad thing.
I'm like, yeah, let's fuck some shit up, girl. You know what I mean? Like, destruction is how things are born or how things are remade. And it's, it's like beautiful, you know, it's the death and rebirth and there's just so much beauty, I think, in destruction. But then I also think, but then what I hear you talking about is also this other kind of destruction that I think you're afraid of, which is that you're going to like, [00:28:00] what you said is destroy everything you love.
And really, so when I think about that, it's like your, your, your marriage, your husband and your kids, like, that's really probably what's most important to you. And I think there is a way in which destruction can be destroyed. Like I said, beautiful, and there's a way in which destruction can be like really toxic.
Yeah, right,
Kyley: like self sabotage destruction.
Eva: Yeah, like there's a way in which Bertha Mason, which I don't think is the vibe I'm getting, but she, the un, maybe the part that you're afraid of is like the unhinged version of her, who's like, fuck all you guys, like, I'm going to leave my husband and I'm not going to take care of my kids anymore because that's.
That's, you know, and I think that would actually, I don't actually think that's what you want. And I think that's what you're afraid of, you know?
Kyley: Yeah, it's interesting because that has been a fear that's come up so many times that if I actually like peel the more layers that I peel off that I'm going to get down to this part of me who's like these out to my kids, my husband.
[00:29:00] Um, and what's interesting as we're having this conversation, I like felt into the place where that kind of fear lives. And I, I, It's like I saw a hollowed out bowl, like that, that, that particular, so this may be cops going to be on a convoluted, but as I'm emerging, as I'm like spring birth and Mason free, um, I'm also seeing that.
I don't think I have, I don't think I'm actually afraid that I'm going to peace out on my kids and my husband anymore. I actually think that I have rooted deeply enough into the safety of how much. I am loved because actually that's a big part. That's, that's what, that's what was there, right? Was this like, if I am myself, if I peel off all the layers and the masks, then I will be discovered and I'll be rejected for that discovery.
Like whatever is underneath, whenever we get all the way down to the most [00:30:00] authentic me, she's undesirable. Uh, and so it's not safe. So I will have to choose. Freedom or love and what I'm actually, what's actually real time, real time magic, everybody that I'm seeing that, um, I don't actually think that I'm afraid that my kids and my husband won't let me be who I am, that I don't actually think that here in this home, I will be required to choose between those two.
Oh,
Eva: that is so beautiful. And I think that is, that's huge. Meaning this real time magic that's happening, I think as a reflection of like, uh, you know, years and layers of, of shedding and healing or whatever you want to call it. That's I can see very clearly. Cause I think you've expressed that fear before, like years before now you don't have that fear anymore because you trust Being loved and that can only come from your own, [00:31:00] like, personal liberation death cycles,
Kyley: perhaps.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So, yeah. So, can I ask a question of you actually does that ever happen to you where, like, because I feel like this happened a couple times in conversation with you in particular, where I'll bump into an old fear and realize that Like it's a cardboard cutout now that all the like gnarly stuff that was living behind that I've tended to.
And now that fear is like, you know, it's like, it's like how it's like a haunted house where you turn all the lights on and you see the police and the, it's like, Oh, this isn't actually scary anymore. Cause we've, we've done all the work to the things that were behind it. And so now this is just like, Nothing.
You can just blow it away. Does that ever happen to you? Um,
Eva: I don't think so. I, I, I'm trying to think like to understand, just to make sure I understand you mean some, like the, the fear will still pop up, but then when you look at it, you're like, oh, wait, it doesn't actually have a hold on you anymore. [00:32:00] Yeah.
You're like, that's
Kyley: not even that it didn't have a whole, cause I was like still operating as if this was the big fear, but when I actually looked at it, it's like, oh, but there's nothing behind it. There was, and there was for a long time. We've like, we've. You know, burned that away. And so now I'm, I was perhaps up until this moment, still running as if that was the big boogeyman fear.
Eva: Right. Until you saw it
Kyley: clearly. Yeah. Until I saw clearly like, Oh, but actually there's nothing behind it anymore. Right.
Eva: You know, I can't think of any particular, there's, there's no like aha coming to me now where I'm like, I can remember a time and I wouldn't be surprised though, by you're just like, Yeah.
Yeah. Your articulate way of explaining it that I might see it, you know, you know, a couple of weeks, because I feel like what's happened for me, mostly with fears, it's not like it doesn't still show up. And then I'm like, Oh, there's nothing behind it. I have noticed more. So it's like things that I was so paranoid or worried or [00:33:00] fearful about, they just drop off.
And then I realized like, Oh, I haven't worried about that thing in forever. And I'm like, Oh, do you remember that thing that I used to be really concerned about? Like, yeah. Like I needed to buy a house or whatever, you know, like, and then I'm like, I haven't thought about that in years, but I think that's for me more so how I experience, um, like the boogeyman like dropping away or no longer being present.
Kyley: Yeah. I love that feeling as well. And I'm always, I'm always really delighted when those moments of just,
and I think this is what you speak to when you talk about like, it gets to be like, like that to me, that's the effortlessness of change, right? Is that like, these things just fall away and are no more. Um, yeah, but I asked that question because it's that, that thing that, that specific pattern of The fear is still there, but then I discovered [00:34:00] something behind it.
It's happened. I can think of three different times, but it's always happened in conversation with you. Oh. Yeah, I know. The first time it happened. The first time I saw that was when we took loving ourselves and I was in loving ourselves into power. And I had a really profound experience of that. And then there's been, I can't think of the other one right now, but there's been three separate times where that's the thing that's happened, but specifically in conversation with you.
Eva: So that's so interesting. That is really interesting. Well, I love that for you.
So going back to this discussion about power and destruction though. So what I'm hearing you say that then it's like, okay, so if the thing that you care about most, you're no longer afraid of like destroying then. Is the fear that just being your big ass self, you know, your powerful, magical, honest, fearless self is going to hurt people's feelings or, you know, it will destroy not just hurt [00:35:00] people's feelings, but will destroy some shit.
And, um. I mean, I think you already know the answer to this, but, um, then, then, then if it's like, you're not, if you're not going to lose anything, not, not, you're not going to lose the thing that matters most to you, then is this the stage where it's like, Hey, giddy up, let's go.
Kyley: I think we're, I think we're approaching that.
I think this, this realization that about the destruction feels like a really big deal. I can feel it's funny. You shifted your language about hurting people's feelings, but I actually do think I'm really afraid of hurting people's feelings. I actually think that's quite loud. Um, you know, I'm a. I, my, my programming is codependency and people pleasing, right?
I've done a lot to shift it, but that's still the programming. And I think, um, yeah, I think that I am, I think that I'm definitely afraid to hurt people's feelings. I'm afraid to say things that will make people uncomfortable, which is funny [00:36:00] because literally my whole work is about like, come be uncomfortable.
It's fine. Yeah. I
Eva: think I'm just trying to run through my system. If I. How I experience people pleasing because I'm, I, I have the, we've, you know, we, we have the same shit in this way. I'm also very much a people pleaser. Um, and I would say in some ways I would be like even more so than you. I don't know if that's true, but there've been many times, you know, in our partnership together and running this podcast together, I've just seen you be very assertive and direct.
You're very good at that. I think you're really good at being like, Oh, whatever. It doesn't, you know, like you just chew the point and there's an effect. Efficiency. Sometimes your energy where I will like overthink something like ad nauseum because I need to get it right. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So I don't know.
I'm like, I
Kyley: think, am I afraid of hurting
Eva: people's feelings? I'm sure it's there, but I'm curious for you. It seems louder [00:37:00]
Kyley: and I wonder if it's louder because it's dying. You know how that happens? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so I really appreciate you saying that. I liked the way you just described me. Oh, I mean, and
Eva: it's also so obvious to me.
Yeah.
Kyley: I like it because it feels true and it also just feels really warm, especially as I'm, you know, giving myself permission to be. Yeah. I don't know. Big and destructive and efficient.
Eva: Yeah. I mean, I'm actually really excited to see where this journey is going to take you because well, I'm going to benefit from it, you know, like anytime I see one of my like beautiful goddess female friends step more into their power, like there's a positive, like it's modeled for me.
Right. And so I gained something out of that, which is also just like. Another reason for us to step into our power because, you know, as they say, like you're doing people a favor, it's not harm, like your own personal liberated self [00:38:00] is a gift to other people.
Kyley: Yeah. It's funny too. I'm thinking as we're talking about this, I think I am really afraid of hurting people's feelings, which I also didn't realize until we had this conversation that that was like in here loud.
And I'm kind of wondering like, why?
Eva: Exactly. That's where my question was going to go. Cause like my people pleasing shows up as like. I care a lot about what other people think maybe like more so than I might be consciously aware, but I don't know if I care about, but it doesn't, it doesn't show up as much as like as hurting people's feelings.
Maybe that's okay. That's because I'm a Capricorn and I'm like, there is an insensitivity to me sometimes. That's just like, whatever. But, but anyway, and I, I point that out. Because I think people pleasing shows up in different ways for different people. And it seems like your flavor is like being afraid of hurting people's feelings.
And I'm curious, like, has this always been here?
Kyley: I don't know. You know, [00:39:00] I sometimes think that when we have fears like this, like, you know, the hurting people's feelings, or probably like your fear of, um, losing your mind or my fear of being destructive, sometimes I think it's because we actually know that we've got a superpower that's related to that thing.
Right. Meaning I do fuck shit up. Right. Like you come and work, you come and work with me and like, we're going to blow some shit out. Like we are going to be destructive. You know, my work is, you know, I, I wouldn't call it destructive, but it's not, uh, it's, it. It's, I would not call it that, right? Um, I mean, I can
Eva: already see the headline though for your next program, like destruction, like just, it could be like a whole program about destruction.
I would be like, yes, sign me the fuck up. Oh my God, I did
Kyley: have an op once after I did a like, like mini pro self promo thing that was about like being queen of shadows and like the mold divide of coaches, which is a, which is a like [00:40:00] crystal, like notoriously, like Fuck shit up. And like, it's like, you know, breaks all the things that need to be broken.
And my aunt was like, what, what, what's, what's all this shadow, shadow, is that going to like, do people like that? I've, it seems like maybe just like, there's like a nicer,
Eva: right? Like she was concerned. Right. She was like, very
Kyley: concerned. Yeah. But it doesn't seem like good business then.
Eva: And I just want to see the picture of you with like a sledgehammer over your shoulder.
Just
Kyley: like, yeah. Yeah. But I, and I think, I think maybe that's it too. Right. Is like my, my, I, I've created a lot of safety in my life by being nice and kind, you know, I've, I've, I've gotten a lot of accolades for it. I've gotten a lot of, I've just created a lot of safety and, and accrued care by being considerate and kind and.
And I don't think those things are false. You know, I genuinely [00:41:00] love being in love with people in my life. And I think maybe the fear, which is very interesting, because this is actually a whole conversation I recently had with a client and now I'm like, Oh, it's me too. Yep. Yep. Um, but, uh, Yeah. I think maybe the fear has to do with, I mean like lose the, the fear of hurting people's feelings maybe has to do with losing the identity of being someone who's nice and kind and the, the safety that I have accrued from that.
And also like the way that I use that to flag, like, you know, yeah,
cause it doesn't feel so much like I'm afraid of their rejection of me. That could be it. I'm sure that's been in the past, right? It doesn't feel like, oh, I'm not super nice and kind people will reject me. I think it's more, [00:42:00] I think it's more about my own identity and maybe not wanting to see myself as something other than just like sweet and nice and kind and gentle.
Eva: Yeah. Okay. So much that I want to say about this is that like, one, that moment when we're on the precipice of like, Changing identities, because that actually does happen. You're like, Oh, I'm, I'm, I'm not going to, I don't, I'm not going to respond and behave and act the same way that I used to anymore. Like that is always a little bit scary.
And that's, and I think that's okay. Like I bring that up to say like so much compassion for that. Right. Because what I can sense is like, Oh, you're like your attitude, like might actually start changing. Right. And, and, and that's just like a big shift. And also the other piece that I, okay, so that's like the first thing that I want to say.
The second thing that I want to say is like, as you were talking, it was just so clear to me that I was like, Oh, you got a little bit of asshole in you. [00:43:00] Yes.
Kyley: Yeah. Yes. And she was under
Eva: wraps. Yes. And I'm like, I think that's what you're afraid of. It's just like, yeah. And then, and then let me just lead this into the third part, which is you were saying like.
The fear that we have, I think, is connected to the power that we wield. And I think the reason you have a little bit of asshole in you is because you have a way of seeing, you're like a seer, you see things really clearly. Like you call shit out, you call me out on my shit and you,
Kyley: it's just direct
Eva: and it's efficient.
And it's like, I don't want to have to fucking sugar, sugar coat this anymore because it just takes too much time. Like, I just want to be, the asshole part of me has an opinion and it's really fucking loud. And I just want to have to tell you what it is without needing to effort
Kyley: to make it polite. And my, I can feel my Bertha Mason being like, she gets it.
She's like, this bitch gets it. Yes. And like, because there are moments where I will, you [00:44:00] know, you'll, I will just say, Hey, I'm seeing a thing. I'm just going to tell you what I see. And it's, it's, it's for context listeners. It's not a like, In our interpersonal relationship thing, it's like a thing I will see you kind of looping on or thinking through and, and I'll just, and I did this to a good friend of mine, another good friend of mine, just the other day when I was just like, she was like, how do you think, you know, X, Y, and Z is going to turn out?
And I, the actual answer felt fucking vicious, right? It was like, it felt really intense. And I was so, I kept saying, this is the part where I'm, I'm, I'm not saying sorry for this. Right. Because, and once again, she's also like, Oh my God, you're exactly right. Thank you. Right. And, and it gave her access to them, like really turning on the fire for this project that she was working on, um, where previously she had been having some trouble to it.
And, and, and so it's interesting because it is yes to efficiency. Thank you for that language. And yeah, this can, it [00:45:00] can, it can feel almost like an, like assholish in the sense that it's just, it could be cutting. If you, if you weren't ready to hear it, it could be cutting. Um, because what I'm going to do is say, here's the way in which you're abandoning yourself.
Right. Yeah. And. I trust saying it to you because I know you love me and I trust saying it to my friend because I know that she trusts my good intentions. Maybe that's it. It's like when I send you that message, I know, A, you like hearing that kind of shit, but B, you will receive it with the intentions of care.
So I don't have to put all the caveats of like, I love you and you're great and it's okay. I can just say the thing. And I think maybe like in other areas, I feel like, but will they know that I care? Will they know that I'm good? Well, they know that I'm good. Yeah. So again, monsters once again, trying to be good.
That
Eva: was actually what I was going [00:46:00] to say at the very top of the show. Cause I'm like, there's no way this isn't going to be connected to goodness or badness, like inevitably. Um, and also I think it's also related to being misunderstood, which is something that you brought up to me. You pointed out to me that I have this fear of being misunderstood, which I'm still unraveling.
Cause like, I would have never used that language before. And I have in just, just the few months that you've like, I'm like, I see it in a whole different way, but it's like, your intentions are good, right? Like, when you tell someone the truth, you don't mean harm. You're like, I'm just being honest. It could be misconstrued as being something
Kyley: else.
As you're saying that, my birth Mason is like, who gives a fuck if it's good or not? Like who, who, who is defining this good? Is it, are they pleased by your truth telling? That's not good. Like, what is this good that, what it, what I can feel this part of, you know, like, what are you even trying to accomplish with this good and its [00:47:00] safety?
It's if I'm honest, if I'm totally fucking honest, it's not even that I want to be good because good is good. I want to be good because I think that I will be safe there. Oh my god,
Eva: Kyley, who are you? Me? Like, what's happening here? Hanging out for too long? Like, am I just passing my shit on to you? Because I'm like, yeah, I get it.
That's, that's where the root of all my fear is. It's like,
Kyley: yeah, yeah, it's all so that I can be safe.
Eva: But it's but anyway, but the point is, though, is that What's so lovely about conversations like this is that it allows us to notice and I really, and I think I may have shared this with you before, but I've been really playing around with the, with the, um, experiment of like, maybe noticing is enough.[00:48:00]
Like, what if all you had to do was really notice, like, because noticing is seeing and you're like, Oh, I see now. And then, I don't know. I don't want to like, I just, this has happened to me many times where I just see something clearly and I don't have to do anything. It just starts to unravel like in my unconscious mind or my body somehow.
Kyley: You know this. Yeah. Yes. Yes. I think this is so important. I think. I think. There's something you're probably, I think there's something you're doing with the noticing that's also important because I think it's also a letting go. Right. It's like, you see, you witness, and then it's not even that it's not even that we let go, but it's that we are willing to let go.
And it's like, okay, what's happening right now? It's like, I can see, oh, I am just wrapped up and trying to be fucking good. Cause I think that will make people like me and that will keep me safe. And also I could just set the paradigm of good on fire. [00:49:00] That's actually what's moving through me right now is like, perhaps, which once again, oh man, she's like getting real excited with her tin cup on the bars.
Right. Like, um, it's like, yeah. Okay. What if we set the paradigm of good on fire and all I have to do is notice and then be willing to let go. And then I will be. Either given the opportunity or it will, you know, to like work through or it will just fade away.
Eva: Yeah. Oh, and I will add to that. I mean, yes, to all of those things.
And there is like this letting go, but I also think there's a step in between for me between, between like the noticing and the letting go, which is the middle step is like, but also the noticing helps me be like, but this isn't true. Like, I don't actually believe this. Like, I don't believe the reason the noticing is like, when I say clear seeing, like you see things clearly, it's because you're like, it's the truth.
You're like, Oh wait, but this is going to make me safe. Like there's almost like, um, sometimes we're so hooked in that it's [00:50:00] not, uh, That we still believe it. And that's fine. You know, I, that happens to me all the time where I'm like, I know this isn't true intellectually, but I still feel it. And then there's sometimes where your body is just like, oh, that's not true.
And it can just, it's very simple. You know, we were
Kyley: like, that's what I was talking about. That right there is actually what I was talking about with the, like, um, all the roots are gone behind the thing. And so the fear is, you The fear of running, but when you actually look at it, there's nothing behind it.
That's the feeling of like, wait, this isn't true. And so there's an energy of like, Oh, I literally could just like crumple this up and throw it away. This just can go away now. Oh, that's
Eva: what you mean. Okay. Well, if that's what you're talking about, yes, I would say that happens to me. All the fucking time, like, like, I
Kyley: mean, like, literally it like shows up and it's strong and it's with you.
So I'm like, this is a, this is an Eva gift that I'm
Eva: somehow receiving. Oh, that is so interesting. So that's, and it's cool to hear how you describe it, because I will say that actually happens to me, like, like weekly, weekly. [00:51:00]
Kyley: Cause I'm more, I feel like I stumble into things more often where it's the witnessing is.
Like just the deep has to has has to do with the deep feeling and the like, you know, the feeling of it and then trusting that to let it move. Um, like I feel like I bump into things that have roots more often and then there's a like sitting in. It is a real, that is a, it's really fun when you're just like.
I mean, talk about efficiency. You're just like, what? It's just not true.
Eva: Bye. Yeah. And it feels like a, like, I've seen that it's like, like a hat. I can like, visualize. I'm doing this thing with my hand, just people that you can't see, but it's like, boom, boom, boom. I can see three things that I think are holding up this old belief.
And then I just like swat them away, like flies and they just dissolve. And I'm like, Oh wait, I don't believe in any of those things anymore. Okay, well,
Kyley: I am, I am opening the floodgates to more of this power and like, just, you know, allowing it in my own system or because it is great. It is very efficient.
I love it. I'm signing on for more.
Eva: Well, yeah, thank you for pointing that out because I [00:52:00] guess I just assume that this is how it is. You know how sometimes you like do something, you just assume that's how it always is. All the time. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. All the time. Okay, Kyley, I have a, I have a question that I'm really, um, excited to ask you though.
Yeah. Which is that when you, when you think of Birth of Mason and you're thinking about basically she's this powerful bitch. We like can, you know, untouchable in some ways. Um, I think I'm just really curious, like what power feels like to you. And like, so like, and really what I want to do is also maybe use this as an opportunity to.
Um, birth, this new version of you, that's already like kind of here, but maybe like solidifying the outline a little bit more, because I already know that I love this Kyley. And like, like I said, she's going to be helpful for me. [00:53:00] And I think in a way, it's a little bit of the same as like how I told you before, I don't think we recorded this, recorded this on the podcast, but I told you, I had this fear of being like pretentious or arrogant or something like that.
And then you told me that I should just like, be pretentious and arrogant, like really embody that version of myself. And I, I think I, I'm just genuinely curious, like, what is that version of powerful Kyley?
Kyley: When you asked that question, if I'm totally honest, my heart did a little like,
So we're still, you know, we're still getting, we're still, it's a process. Yeah. Well,
Eva: that's good. That the right question. Yeah.
Kyley: Yeah. Um, I mean, I think it feels like not giving a fuck, you know, there's such a,
there's such joy and freedom. And I think real generous compassion that comes from, we don't give a fuck. And I'm just thinking [00:54:00] about like, which is funny that this is the answer. This is what's coming in immediately. But I'm actually thinking about. How good it feels when I'm kind from this place of not giving a fuck because it's totally genuine, right when I Offer care to like, you know some random fucking person at the coffee shop Yeah, like yesterday actually yesterday or the day before this is this is so funny.
This is the example that's coming in but it feels like it's It's actually giving me an antidote to some of the, some of the earlier fears I spoke to. But I was really feeling this vibe of just like, Oh, I'm untouchable. I'm so great. And like, I don't give a fuck and everything's great and the world is taking tremendous care of me.
And Oh my gosh. And I went to this like coffee shop and I just like, it's just such a genuine, beautiful, hilarious connection with the guy who was working there. And [00:55:00] there was no performance in it. It was just, like, for a real moment, this guy and I were cracking up together while I ordered my coffee and sandwich.
And, and, yeah, and there was just something so rich. And the word I keep thinking of is, like, generous. There was such a deep generosity to the energy because I didn't need to perform. And I didn't need to pretend, and I didn't need to hide. Yeah, and therefore, like, not giving a fuck was the secret answer to it.
Like actually giving all the fucks.
Eva: I think, yeah, and I would say not giving a fuck is actually the answer to being a really loving person because then the outside world, it's not a threat. Like nothing can touch you. Like nothing is a threat. And that is really big, has been really big medicine for me because it actually made me realize how often I walk through the world, [00:56:00] like perceiving.
People and things as a threat, which is actually kind of heartbreaking
Kyley: myself, the threat, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, I love that we went on this whole journey about how I'm afraid to be Bertha Mason because I'll fuck shit up and be destructive. And then the end, she's like, yeah, dummy. I'm a secret unconditional.
Eva: Well, and actually, I would argue, all of our effort to not be a threat is actually what makes us more dangerous. Cause we're, anytime we have to like, um, contort ourselves, even like 1%, if we're like not actually totally free, that manifests in some way. And that that's not helpful. And it could just be like a little bit of resentment, a little bit of judgment, like a little bit of impatience or something.
You know what I mean? It's just like that little bit of off that [00:57:00] could go actually unnoticed until actually you, until you like experience that piece and that. That point of not giving a fuck that you actually see the contrast between the two.
Kyley: Yeah. Yeah. Right. Because to the point of burning up the paradigm of good, like when we're trying, I mean, I've said this on the podcast a million times, this is what I teach almost, you know, it's like, almost like, I think this is good wisdom, but like when we're trying to be good.
If you're trying to do something, what is that, Yoda, like, there is no try, there's only do or whatever, like, when you're trying to be good, and then that's your operating logic, it's like, I gotta try to be good, I gotta prove that I'm good, I gotta earn that I'm good, love, fill in love, fill in whatever, safety, uh, what you're actually telling yourself is that you don't believe that you are those things, because when you're those things, you don't have to try, right?
I'm gonna have to try being smart if I just know that I'm smart, but if I, but I have to try at the things that I [00:58:00] think I'm shit at. And so it makes it performative instead of genuine and it makes it all barbed with this energy of threat.
Eva: Where I get stuck is that I feel like this mantra or this like theory of like, let's not give a fuck.
I don't care what other people think. Um, it's actually frustrated me for a long time because I feel like it's the general advice that people give, but I actually think it's so hard to do. And so when I hear you say like. I don't like there's the freedom is in not giving a fuck. And that's where actually our like pure love comes out.
I'm like, that's actually the same thing that I want to, every time I'm afraid, I'm afraid of going crazy or like, or, or being misunderstood because I'm, I give a fuck,
Kyley: but I don't,
Eva: my problem with not giving a fuck is if he still feels like it's something to do because it's the sound, it feels like you're, um, It's like you're saying trying to be good and then so then when people are like, well, don't care [00:59:00] what other people think or not, don't give a fuck is you stuff to try.
Kyley: So, or to use language that you've used on me. What if you just didn't give a fuck about the fact that you give a fuck?
Wow.
Eva: I'm gonna have to like, sit with that one for a little bit. I feel like you're getting me a dose of my own medicine or something. Meaning the acceptance, like this is.
Kyley: Yeah, this is like, cause we're, we're really doing, we're, we're just talking about surrender surprise, surprise, hello universe episode that's secretly about surrender.
Right. Cause what is not giving a fuck, not giving a fuck is like, I'm not in charge of how people perceive me or what the outcome is. I'm just going to be me. Consequences be damned. Um, And we're just like, I surrender what the consequences will be. I'm going to trust that I can be me and that that will, that that's the, that's the path.
That's the only option. Um, [01:00:00] and so I feel like one of the gifts you've given me, it's like, you just, what's the point of surrender that's available. What's the point of letting go that's available. You just go there. Yeah. Right. And so maybe. You want to get to the place of like, Oh yeah, I don't give a fuck at all about going crazy, but maybe the first entry point is actually like, you know what?
I give so many thoughts about going crazy and I accept that.
Eva: Yeah. Yeah, actually I can totally see how that is already like, like I can relax because I'm like, that's like loving what is where am I? This is where I am. But the irony of course is like when I accept where I am, then I get to drop a level deeper.
Okay,
Kyley: real time feedback, because you used exactly this line on me, we were talking offline, and I was talking about my cell phone use, and I was just talking about, weren't you fucking crazy, and you were like, you stress about your cell phone use more than, like, we're all addicted to our phones, and you stress about it so much, and you were sort of like, What if you stopped, like, resisting the fact that you [01:01:00] check your phone a million times?
What if you just stopped making that wrong? And I've, in the time of our conversation, I was like, No, I am very interested in making it wrong because I don't like it. Right, right. Yeah. But it sunk, it like seeped in, you know, like rainwater, you know, it like seeped in. And I thought of, I've been thinking of you so much because every time I pick up the phone now.
And I have that like, then I also immediately have this like, little breeze of compassion. That's like, okay, this is what we do. Yeah. And, and I can, I can feel how that is also actually giving, like giving me permission to then soften into using the phone less. Right. We're not there yet necessarily, but I can see how accepting what is, is the only way you actually change the thing underneath that.
Eva: All right. I'm gonna have to experiment with that. But, and do you think that that's. I don't know. I think this might be a 2P continued conversation because I would love to go on a Kyley and Eva journey of like experimenting about not giving a fuck and like see what that feels like [01:02:00] and share notes, you know, and like compare notes and experiences because I want to know.
Yeah. And if you, if you have like little tidbits or wise sage advice, as you often do in your process, like I want to know because I'm like, yeah, this is also what I want. Like my freedom of but for me, I feel like it's not about not giving a fuck. It's almost like about
Kyley: being so
Eva: Grounded in who and what I am and what I believe that maybe it doesn't have to feel like effort to not give a Fuck, do you know
Kyley: what I mean?
Yeah. Yeah, I do and and I also think that I think what we're talking about Is that like power to bring it back to the top is like power is about permission to really authentically be yourself without conditions or caveats or masks. Right? That's I think that's ultimately what power feels like. It's just like the truth of trusting the safety.[01:03:00]
And truth of being who you fucking are and, and so in that, to that extent, I think the not giving a fuck that feels like Kyley language, right? That feels like the, this, this part of me that I am in the process of like springing free from her jail, her medicine on some level is about not giving a fuck, but I don't necessarily think that's everyone's language because to your point, not everyone has the same, their prison isn't made of the same shit, you know what I mean?
Um, but, but I think, But I think that's what my flavor of fear is about.
Eva: Well, I just so appreciate you bringing this topic, uh, to the table. And I do actually think this is going to be a to be continued
Kyley: conversation. I mean, if Bertha Mason has her way, we are entering the Kyley doesn't give a fuck era, so we're still negotiating, but like, that's her [01:04:00] agenda.
Eva: Alright, well, uh, love this Bertha, love her, support her in everything that she wants to do, and I hope You lead the charge, Kyley, because then I can follow suit.
Kyley: Oh, thank you. This is exactly what I needed. This is good.
Eva: Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Okay.
Kyley: So joy, joy. Yeah. Okay. You already teased me that you had something I want to know more about for joy.
So you
Eva: go first. Well, my time here in Taiwan is coming to an end. And so I've been reflecting, I feel like I have actually so many different joys that I could share, but I'll. I guess my joy is to say that I felt very, I felt very, even though my time here has been incredibly challenging, it's also been very rewarding.
And for that, I feel grateful. And on a more tangible note, um, I've talked before about my love of Chinese medicine, and especially in Taiwan. And, um, I [01:05:00] went to my Chinese medicine doctor and told him that like, I have really bad periods still. And, you know, I get crazy PMS and I get really tired and blah, blah, blah.
So he fixed me up this like concoction of like mushroom, like reishi mushrooms and herbs and all natural and cooked me up this like really thick. Potent sewer looking like water tea decoction and I drank it for a week before my period and had like The smoothest experience I've ever had. And I was like, Oh, like, yeah, this shit like totally fucking works.
And so then I went back and got more to help with other things. So like the, the, they say that like, even if you just come back once a year, we can like recalibrate your body and, um, and you know, like set you up to be good for a few months.
Kyley: But I think what are you able to have this for you with you in Brazil?
Well,
Eva: no, because it's like, um, like the liquid kind needs to be like, refrigerated. It's also like [01:06:00] quite heavy. And so I only have a limited amount of baggage space, so I'll just wait until I come back next time. But it's not being meant, you're not supposed to take it every month. It's supposed to be like, yeah, it's like you, it's supposed to like just reset your system in a way.
Anyway, I think what is so exciting about this is I just can't believe this is like a resource here. It's like. herbs. It's like a country where people recognize that herbs are real medicine. And, and it's just so cool. Like they take all these herbs that like, we kind of, you know, we read about in American, like, uh, health culture and sometimes we'll take supplements or whatever, but this is like, Oh no, they just have all of this shit and they make the tea.
I don't know. It's just so cool. It's so cool. And I just, um, really appreciate it. So that's my joy.
Kyley: I love that. Joy. Yeah. I love hearing about, I mean, I love just the, yeah, the rich, a supplement is different, right? It's like me going online and being like, Oh, this is supposed [01:07:00] to be good for me, which is very, very different from someone with like an incredible rich body of wisdom and saying, here's the particular concoction for you.
Yeah. And it's like,
Eva: yeah, and it's all natural. And when I say I had like the smoothest period, I mean, like, usually I get so tired. Sometimes I'm like bedridden and this was like, nope, I was out and about and like taking my mom to her doctors. Like I was like, it was
Kyley: like, that's a huge deal. It was, yeah, it's
Eva: like going from bedridden.
Kyley: I've been on the journey, like, you know, as a friend, like. Yeah. It's a big deal. It's a big
Eva: deal. Yeah. So, very cool. And maybe if you come to Asia, ever, we can take you to the Chinese medicine doctor for whatever, for whatever heals you.
Kyley: Yes, please. Yes, please. Nick will come and eat all of the food with you and I will go visit the Chinese medicine doctor.
Sounds great. Great. Great. Um.
Eva: Thank you, Kyley. What's bringing you joy this
Kyley: week? I have so many joys. [01:08:00] Um. I hosted a retreat last weekend in Miami. Oh my god,
Eva: yes, we haven't even had a chance to talk about that yet, dude. Ah, I'm like so jealous. It just sounds so fun.
Kyley: It was really fun. It was really fun. I mean, this was a one on one retreat that I've done a couple of now.
So I was like, oh, I guess this is a thing I do. I should tell people that I do
Eva: this. Yes. When I say I'm jealous, by the way, I want to be on the receiving end. Like, I want to, I want to fly you somewhere so you can hang out with me and then help me with all my shit, like. Which is amazing.
Kyley: That's just going to happen when I come visit you in Brazil eventually, like that's, we're going to do that.
Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Um, and so that was just like, it was, that felt so, I actually wrote a post on for this on Instagram, but like Miami is a city that I went to when I was like 24. And I remember just feeling like, I don't belong in the city. These people are too sexy. Like what? Well, also feeling like this is so cool that I got flown to Miami right about 24 for work.
Wait,
Eva: can I interrupt you really quick? Cause I know you have to go soon, but I am [01:09:00] really curious. Like what is the Miami vibe? I've never been. Oh,
Kyley: Miami. I, I, I have come to really love Miami. Uh, there's, and there's not just one vibe, you know, but it's just, it's a really colorful, vibrant, alive city.
Eva: Yeah. I mean, I want to go to Miami from what I've heard.
It sounds really cool. It sounds
Kyley: sexy. It's very sexy. Um, in a way too, that's like, uh, yeah, like people just like, I don't know, I guess I always feel like people love their bodies there in a way that obviously is very different from my, like New England vibes, right? Where we're like Catholic and Puritan and, uh, wear giant sweaters and flannel for half the year.
Um, and, but it's not. But it doesn't have like an LA flavor to me where it's like your body has to look a certain way. I mean, I'm sure that is, you know, that's always stuff they're advised, but it just feels like a very vibrant city, very sexy, very [01:10:00] like, it's a great thing to be in a body and like eat good food and be in the sun and dance and you, you would really love Miami.
And it's a very European city, like they literally just add 20 percent tip because so many Europeans go there that never they don't remember you're supposed to tip. So everywhere you go, they just default because so many Europeans go there. Yeah. Um, and so it has like a very. You know, European flavor in that way.
And then there's just like tons of incredible food. So I'm like street food to like very, very bougie, expensive restaurants. Um, but yeah, it's just like very vibrant. It's just, um,
Eva: sounds awesome.
Kyley: Okay. Yeah. And it was just a really, ah, I just, just loved. I am really in awe. And I, this was my kind of recurring experience in this retreat.
It's like, holy shit, this is my life, you know, that I. You know, when I first started this business was like, wouldn't it be nice [01:11:00] if I got to like, give people a little bit of magic every once in a while, and now I get flown to fucking world class and stay at bougie ass hotels, and like, fuck people up on magic and help change their lives like what?
Eva: Wow. Yeah, I mean, you really should advertise this a little bit more because it feels like a big deal and like you just like are so under the radar and covert about it like this happens sometimes. But I mean, like. This is an amazing service. And, um, yeah, if you can afford it, I, I highly think that you should do it.
Like, cause I think that's what everyone, especially if you want to run a business, like who doesn't want that? Basically it's almost like consulting, but like
Kyley: with more magic and actually this last one, isn't the woman's not even a business owner. It wasn't even about business. It was just like personal. I mean, she, there's a project that she was working on.
And so we spent some time working on this project, but it was just really like a personal transformation retreat. Oh my God. Even better. Yeah, I know. I know. I know. So yeah, I've done them for business. I've done them for personal transformation. [01:12:00] I, um, yeah, I think this is a thing. So if you're listening and you want one of these.
Let's chat. Yeah.
Eva: Hopefully you live somewhere cool. Or you can meet somewhere.
Kyley: Cool. That's what you did? Just, yeah, that's what we did. We picked, we were both on the East coast and I was like, can we go somewhere more ? Oh, you guys picked, oh my God, that's even better. Yeah. Yeah. That's what I found. For all of these, like we, we travel to a new location.
I mean, there's people, so people in New England, I have a couple options on my radar for like a day, like a place where I think I could host a pretty swanky and fun day retreat. Um, but outside of that, we. Yeah, we get on a plane and go somewhere and this is a big piece for me when I do these is that I pick a place where the earth is very alive because then she offers the holding and her own medicine.
So I did it at a hot springs in the desert. I did it in the desert in, uh, in Arizona. Now I did it on the ocean in Miami. Like there's a [01:13:00] way that it's like, I want a like bougie luxe. Experience of care while like, so I want to pick like a great swanky place to be and I want the earth to like do the heavy lifting, you know, of just holding us.
Eva: That's so cool. Kyley. You should, I don't know. I'm just in awe. Seriously. Yeah.
Kyley: Yeah, yeah, and I can also feel Bertha Benson's like, yeah, and you know what, if we weren't afraid of fucking people up, we would do more of that, you
Eva: know what I mean? Well, totally, but also, I'm not worried, I totally see this in your horizon, like, the not worrying about fucking people up thing.
Yes, yes, it's, it's, this conversation is a sign that it's already on
Kyley: its way, you know? Also, it's, like, I've, I've, I've gone through the fear of not, of fucking people up, like, I've done this cycle before, right? So to the point where I would all the time, like, this is not a thing that's like, I'm going to check off the list and be done with like this, I'm just going to keep going around and around, but deeper each time to like peel off new layers.[01:14:00]
Eva: Yeah. You know? Yeah. Yeah. Yes, for sure.
Kyley: Yeah. Thank you. Eva. I love you so much. Thank you.
Eva: I adore you and I miss you and I love all you listeners. Thank you so much for just, yeah, hanging
Kyley: around. Yeah. Being you. Send us questions. We want to do more Q and a episodes and we need questions. Yes. So what's, what are your burning questions in your personal life for esoteric meandering?
Eva: Yes, there's, you can DM us, you can email us, and you can also, if you like the show, it's really helpful if you share it with people. That's always huge. Writing a review, doing the whole rating thing, five stars, please. That's our preference.
Kyley: Unless you give us one, one star for swearing. That's my favorite.
That's my favorite review. Why do they swear so much? One star.
Eva: Oh, goodness. All right. We love
Kyley: you. Okay. Bye.